...Okay, I admit I do not follow the GP's that closely,........But,........Is that a freaggin' mess or what? Someone bring me up to speed.

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Yes its a mess.. Loungo has ruined that series and screws over the riders like crazy.. Supposedly they want to keep the very slow riders off the track at the flyaway races in Mexico and Qatar and places like that, so the last moto will be a combo of 250/450 racers on the track together, so they will have less local riders there.. What if a 450 guy knocks down a 250 guy?? What then?? Who knows.. If they are worried about terrible riders from those spots, why go there to race?? MONEY!!!!!!!

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Isn't that the same organization that the AMA copied, which ruined the sport, made two strokes almost extinct and forced four strokes down our throats? The one that folded to the eco-freaks?

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SpeedShifter

The AMA did not force 4 strokes down anyones throat, they are superior machines to 2 strokes period....2 strokes are fun...but 4 strokes are better...line up a 250f vs a 250...the 250 has the power advantage, but doesn't win on every track....eco freaks...you must be a complete dick wad, one that thinks his personnel fun outweighs anything else... a narcissist...go f87k y87rs8elf...

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I think it should be pretty obvious, based on some of their names, that they are foreigners. Why should we believe anything they say? I mean come on! They're not from here. lol

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Not that I support anything GL does. I think the point of the combined final moto is remove the locals from half the races so they can't mess up the GP points main players. Many of the locals in these countrys couldn't win the 250 B class at a local US event and have no business on a GP track. If it's anything other then that, fork'um!

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What a mess,the presidents gone senile and needs a bullet..

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HBT, you must not have been around when the FIM folded under pressure from the eco-freaks and forced four strokes down our throats, and then the AMA followed suit very soon after. Four strokes are heavy as hell, and if you have never ridden a sub-200 pound 250 two stroke, you might not have an idea of how much better life is on a lighter machine. Face it, four strokes cannot be made as light as a two stroke without them breaking in half. 250 two strokes never did beat 125s on every track, although they beat them on most tracks, and in some races a 125 won overall, and not just in motocross. Even in desert races, sometimes a 125 won overall.

The number of dirt bikes that ride around is a puny number, producing a paltry amount of pollution. Meanwhile, diesel 18 wheelers belch black smoke and have no requirement to clean up their act, and there are a hell of a lot more of them than two stroke motocross bikes.

You must be an O-sucker to pretend to love the Earth, turning against the off-road community and joining with the enemy to act like we pollute. We don't pollute jack squat. You want pollution? Listen to a four stroke. Noise pollution to the max. For you, however, it is likely a mating call sounding similar to your better half, Bruce - the sound of unrelenting diarrhea. If that turns you on, whatever floats your boat.

I do not appreciate what the FIM, AMA and the manufacturers did to our sport. You might check MXA, they will also educate you.

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If you hold a World Championship race in a 3rd world backwater, and you don't want to pay anyone other than the works teams to make the trip, then you have no right to complain about a lack of competitive riders on the line. Longuo is a POS and I would have the mother and father of parties if he was hit by a truck and spread out flatter than a pan cake on the freeway.
Personal gain is his aim, nothing else. He couldn't care less about MX. To him and his FIM co-gangsters, it's just a means of making money. He's nothing but a fat pig. Fortunately, I don't believe his plan is sustainable and the house of cards will come crashing down. It can't happen too soon as far as I'm concerned.

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I wasn't bothered to read all that mess in full. Are all the events, continental races included, to have this super final?? I love the reference it makes to having too many teams want to feature riders, and thus they are forced into making these regulation changes. They have been having probs getting 40 riders in both classes of top caliber lining behind the gate, so now they are obliged to put the two classes together. Whata joke. I will only be going to the des nations, cause the gps are turning into a 2nd rate championship (talking about organisation not speed of riders). How many more mx2 champions migrating across the pond is it gonna take before they realise this??? MX is not F1 and it never will be (i hope). Making these incredible super expensive machines and transforming what was a great working class sport, into something only for the upper class. Have they not figured that the upper class prefers golf and polo?? Seriously the identity of this sport is changing for the worse. It used to be so much accessible for pros and amatures alike.

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* so much more accessible. :-)

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Dudes um KTM still makes 2 strokes, Yamaha is still selling them, and theres other options like Gas Gas, Husqvarna, Husaberg. So go buy ur stupid 2 stroke, its there, its still available. Leave the 4 strokes for the MEN that actually want performance out of a bike

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4 strokes rule 2 strokes drool

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4 strokes are better race bikes plain and simple, evolution of the sport and other factors made them the weapon of choice. By the way I own a 250 2 stroke and it's tons of fun, but serious racers choose 4 strokes because they outperform them. And my strung out 250 2t is no cheaper to maintain and run than any stock/mod 250F or 450 I've ever had either. Reason being is I maintain them properly and don't wait until they break to fix them like lots of people. Of course 4 strokes are more to fix if you wait for them to scatter.

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HBT1

If you line up a 250f and a 250 2 stroke you will see that the 2 stroke makes much, much more power, is lighter, is more fun to ride, and will turn faster laps.

This is why, dumb s#%t, the AMA replaced 125 2 strokes with 250 4 strokes and 250 2 strokes with 450 4 strokes. Simply put they are heavy and slow.

Anyone want to ride a 125 4 stroke against a 125 2 stroke? I didn't think so.

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@Langstonfan--dead on, they are making this sport into a Yuppie sport only the wealthy can afford...

@the AMA had no choice but to replace the 2-strokes, because the manufactureres already told them they were phasing out the 2-strokes.. You cant have a class for a machine if they dont continue to make them..
@rg807--sorry that was the case a few years ago, but guys are turning faster laps now on the 250 4-strokes.. Dont get me wrong I love m,y 2-strokes, but it is what it is.. The suspension works better with the 4-strokers, and the traction out of the corners and all are better with them.. I hate it too, but its true. The 2-stroke makes more power, but in a small window of the RPM range, the 4-strokes powerband is broader and easier to use, its why its winning..

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GP's suck these days, just like Pourcel said. It's all too complicated, riders dont get any prize money but have to infact pay big money to be racing. Youthstream ruined the GP's, bunch of greedy dudes.

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Giuseppe Luongo has successfully ruined the GPs for everyone, as he dictates which "rules" and classes run for his own benefit. DC is doing the same thing in the USA...if he continues to promote MX Nat'ls on tracks that are simply modified SX courses ( see Utah's upcoming MX Nat'l ). C'mon folks...we love our spport, let's not let $$$ overrule the challenge of racing over natural terrain...simply so sponsors can sit in a shaded chair and see the entire course from one vantage point.

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Adapt or die!

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@rg807 you cant compare a 250 4 stroke to a 250 2 stroke, they are 2 completely different engines, a 2 stroke engine has a power stroke for every revolution and a 4 stroke engine only has a power stroke every other revolution, so a 2 stroke has twice the amount of power strokes than a 4 stroke thats why you have to double the capacity of the 4 stroke engine when compared to a 2 stroke. I did a drag race the other day on my YZ 250F against a KTM 300 2 stroke, i really did expect to get my ass kicked but we raced in a straight line and i was about 2 bike lenghts ahead the whole time, and we had the same gearing!!! just shows its not just about the power it has alot to do with how you put that power to the ground and 4 strokes can just put the power to the ground so much better!

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I dont think anyone doubts that the 4 stroke is better performance. Thats not the point. Its not a sustainable business model, assuming the same target audience are buying bikes. Im all in favour of developing bikes which go faster than the previous years bike. I was around on supercross.com message board when the rumour was in the air. The state of California, the 5th largest economy in the world, was gonna make a pollution law change (think it was announced around about the 99 2000 seasons). This is my memory by the way, far from factual. But it seemed that after that happened, and finding places to ride on a 2t were going to be more difficult, 4ts all of sudden appeared. I find it hard to believe that the Doug Henry experiment occured because only the guys at yamaha had the bright idea that 4ts are more competitive or at least had that potential. Or is THAT the real reason? 4ts were always allowed, but Yamaha was the only manufaturer that believed that they could be competitive? Cause in 01, those things were pulliny holeshots infront of Patrana, Brown and Langston almost every race. So they were immediately competitive. Can anyone shed any light? Are 4ts here because of the AMA (rule change) or because of Yamaha????????

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SevenEight - dude, seriously, I know how motors work and one drag race doesn't prove anything. That's not exactly scientific. The fact of the matter is 2 strokes put out much more power per CC. At a bare minimum there is inherently far less drag because there are less reciprocating parts, mass, gyroscopic effect, etc.

bd200- just think if all of that engineering had gone into 2 stoke development? We might have simple, light 2 strokes with traction control.

Bottom line- 4 strokes just aren't as fun, regardless if they go faster or not and since 99% of us are riding for fun I can't see what the point is.

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@Outlaw53-- sadly I have to agree--the only reason MXSports moved the race to Salt Lake was for money, period.. They think they can sell more tickets because people can sit in the bleachers.. I remember hearing rumors of this a few years ago, them wanting to hold races at car track because of the bleachers..It sucks, that is supercross, man-made, why does Davey Coombs want that for the Nationals, oh yea, MONEY>> And I would say it is easier to record the race for TV there also, with the facilities, so there is more money there..hmmm!

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I love that people think the AMA "forced" 4-strokes upon us.

If you are unaware of the issues that are the source of the manufacturers making competitive 4-strokes, just don't comment on it. Better yet, do some research and see if you can't find how it came down.

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Geez, I read a couple more of the posts here and am just in shock at the lack of any sort of knowledge on a subject that people are talking about.

Speedshifter:
The government was putting together some pretty stringent pollution control laws aimed at dirt bikes. I don't recall the exact issues the manufacturers were facing, but the main point is the government was going to make it an economic nightmare to continue to try and produce 2-strokes on the same level. The government gave the manufacturers a timeframe to follow in meeting the requirements, and the easiest way to meet the requirements was to go 4-stroke. The manufacturers were being pro-active in making the 4-strokes. In fact, it probably would have been more profitable for them if they could have just continued making 2-strokes. Most people think it was a conspiracy to make money on parts or to increase bike costs. Wrong! At the time the industry was in close to a panic with the threat of these regulations. The manufacturers did such a good job at it that the government basically backed off on the laws some. Now revisitionist history of about 90% of the fans out there has completely changed why 4-strokes ever came back to life. The AMA and FIM had to enact rules to allow these bikes to race since this was where the future had to go. If these laws had been enacted, it might have become illegal to ride a 2-stroke anywhere but on a closed course track due today. As it stands, the manufacturers may have done more to save 2-strokes by switching to 4-strokes than if they hadn't. The apparent goal of the proposed laws was to eliminate 2-strokes completely. Anyone remember when there were 2-stroke street bikes being sold in the U.S.? The government put a stop to that completely.

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The GP system is messed up BAD! Talked to some of the former Top GP riders that were at SX races here in germany - quote "... no one wants to race GPs anymore, no racing, no money, no caring!".

When they removed the "real" qualification, where you needed JUT to be fast on the track instead of piling up money at Luongos desk to get to sunday it worked. At the national and international championships here in germany, just the top 40 guys of qualifiying go to the gates. No exceptions - that's how it has to be!

Now anyone with enough money can get a spot on the GPs. Sure the Top Ten guys are all fast but some of them do not even make money racing!?

For the Cairolis and Herlings's and Roczens the system may work, but the local privateers that dream of their one and only GP points (or AMA Points) to be gathered in heroic efforts on their home soil tracks - that has been taken away.

The big teams are fine with the system - there's no risk their riders won't be their on sunday because there is no eliminating qualifikation anymore!

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This comment string with the 2 stroke vs 4 stroke bickering is hilarious. So much misinformation. A lot has changed in the sport over the years and of a ton of progress has been made on the chassis of a motocross bike. The engine platform is just a small part of the equation and end price.

For those that either don't have much money or just don't want to spend a crap load of money on the sport (by the way, this sport is still dirt cheap compared to any other motorsport in the world) there is good news. You can still find some 2 smokes on the used market for not much money at all. And since most people in the sport suck, with a couple inexpensive mods it will produce more power than 90% of the people can handle anyways.

And if you are one of part of the few who both has the skills and desire to pursue the sport professionally but doesn't have much money then I am sorry but it is going to be difficult. You don't have a right to compete in motocross professionally even if you really really want to. And if the challenge to obtain a decent ride to get noticed and pick up support is too great for you then you need to look elsewhere for employment.

The amount of people that comment on here that don't have the appreciation for the sport and all that the sponsors and those involved do is irritating. As I said, this sport is dirt cheap compared to other motorsports. News flash - motorsports are EXPENSIVE! Good luck getting into any other motorsport for what you can race motocross for. I speak from experience. The RV's, riding classes, practice bikes, etc. are all nice but you don't need any of it. I think maybe some of the younger kids today just have a hard time seeing that. I raced competitively in the intermediate class riding only once a week while in public school with a pickup truck, one bike and a gear bag. At the big races I either rented a motel room nearby, pitched a popup tent or slept in the truck with my dad.

You can get a used bike that is still competitive for under 3 grand. All of your riding gear for under a thousand. Even with some fresh tires, sprockets, and a couple numbers you can be out there on the track for under 5 grand. My old man just spent more than that on the monthly service on his race car! Get with the times people.

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