450 Words: The Vet Classes
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The never-ending search for the next big thing means that the young riders get most of the attention from Loretta Lynn Ranch. The older riders? They get the attention from themselves.
Peer pressure often dictates who runs up front at the ranch in the 25 Plus, 35 Plus, 40 Plus, 45 Plus and 50 Plus classes at the Red Bull AMA Amateur National Championships. Since the event’s inception, many of the age classes have been taken by ex-professionals—Gary Bailey came down to win a 50 Plus title in 1994. Keith Bowen, once of the original stars of this event 30 years ago, came back long after his pro career to lock down four Vet titles.
A real tipping point came in 2002, when Jeff Emig headed back to the Ranch. To test himself, he entered one age class, and the 250 A Pro Sport class each time he showed up. He won the A class in 2002 and 2003, and provided a real test for the fast amateur kids of the time (he beat Josh Hansen in 2002, and Brian Gray in 2003). But Emig also notched a pair of age-class championships, in 2003 and 2006, and made coming back to the Ranch the cool thing to do.
Keith Johnson celebrating his 35 Plus title.
Photo: Ryne Swanberg / Vurbmoto
Eventually, MX Sports turned the 30 Plus class into a B/C designation, to allow riders who had never raced as pros to fight for a title. Right now, some of you are probably saying ex-professionals shouldn’t be allowed to race in any classes at Loretta’s, but keep in mind that these classes are no different than an A class at your local track, and former professionals aren’t banned from those races.
Anyway, this year’s crop featured riders like Clark Stiles, James Povolny, Keith S. Johnson, Robbie Reynard and Scott Sheak. Povolny said he saw Stiles racing the event last year and figured he should go mix it up with a rider he used to battle for top privateer status. Johnson once set his sights on the all-time King of Titles at the Ranch, Kevin Walker, and over the last few years has really overtaken Kevin as the measuring stick in these classes. Walker didn’t qualify this year due to injuries, and is dealing with some off-track issues (an arrest) that you’ve probably heard about. And Doug Dubach, who has crushed it here for the last few years, didn’t race this year. But there was some new life in the form of Sheak. He’s only been back on a bike for a few months after hitting the bottom of a downward spiral. For him, returning to Loretta’s was about much more than championships.
Stiles took home the 25 Plus and the 35 Plus titles at Loretta's.
Photo: Ryne Swanberg / Vurbmoto
The winners? Stiles won the 25 Plus and 35 Plus crowns, and took the AMA Vet Rider of the Year Award for his efforts. Clark is now a test rider for Dunlop, and very rarely races anymore—his Area and Regional qualifiers and Loretta’s are usually about it each year. This year he faced stiff 25 Plus comp in Reynard, but Robbie crashed out of a moto and busted his bike, ending his title hopes. In 25 Plus, KTM test rider Michael Sleeter and two-time Loretta’s Champ Jimmy Evans were also in the mix, but Stiles was able to fend off their challenges. In 35 Plus, he just edged Johnson, Polvolny and Sheak.
Johnson took 40 Plus, but the 45 Plus and Master’s 50 Plus titles went to first-time champions in David Moegle and Scottie Shipley. Those two swept all three of their motos to leave no doubt. And Chris Brice won 30 Plus B/C class. All in all, the older crowd provided some great racing and great memories. They didn’t get the attention of the next gen, but to them, these races mean just as much.
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Glad to see Scotty Sheak racing again!
I though Sleeter qualified for the Hangtown national this year.
Always a fan of Sheak, Agree with Nick!
I wish they would of shown us some flim of the 45 and 50 plus classes.
Add a 40 plus class under the same 30 Pluse B/C guise; "Eventually, MX Sports turned the 30 Plus class into a B/C designation, to allow riders who had never raced as pros to fight for a title."
I believe Dave Moegle won a class in the 80"s. 250B I think.
The age classes were great to watch.
I hope former pros continue to enter LL.
Vet nationals are for veteran Pro's. Loretta Lynns AMATUER championship series are for AMATUERS.
If they don't have a card and are retired they go back to amatuer.I guess mxfans didn't read what Weeg wrote.I guess mxfans is one of those stubborn morons that can't get it.I guess if your a retired 50 year old pro and haven't raced for 25 years all you can ride are the pro nationals.What a dumb a$$.Sorry they don't have vet beginner class for you mxfans at the amature nationals.You probably still wouldn't make the the area qualifer.
Once a pro always a pro. You can not got back in status to a amatuer, tell that to anyone that is not smart enough to understand it and they will beleive that the Easter Bunny is real.
@AMATUER and @ mxfans-
Agreed you guys are both correct and actually after not having a pro card for a number of years the pro card rider can write a letter to AMA and ask to have yopro card status moved down to B class but never C class.
@mxfans STF u DA-
Your a moron---so STFU !
IMO former factory riders should not be showing up at the ranch and cherry picking in the +25 and +35 classes What they should do for these cherry pickers is make new classes such as +25A and +35A then have +25B/C and +35B/C
My .02 cents. standing in front of the starting gate at portland 250 A amatuer race 1978-79 15 yrs old I think I can win today. Looking down the gate I see, Denney Bentley Hmm " maybe a solid second" I think....look a lil further..."Hmm Jeff Hicks"...maybe a 3rd".... next to Hicks,,,,Alan King, I'm beginning to think this is a bad idea to move up.....Lil further,...1 of the 5-6"? Bigrlow brothers....... I'm in deep trouble"..........let em ride, I dont feel sorry for anyone. new or old.
I'll never forget the nod & smile "welcome to the 2fiddys" by the #1 of Hicks.....was chilling but yet calming.
Btw I really began to dislike Keith Bowen kicking my butt in the 125's too, think it was the b class, his visor pointing up like Hannahs used to...I wanted to wax him badly...but ,,,alas that never happened either.
Why don't you cry about all the years that the B stock class is quite a bit faster than the A class riders.What about when a Stewart or Carmichael moved up from the mini class with 50 mini expert titles and are in the media as much as any pro.Why are they able to move to the B class.The years that they did that they would of smoked the A class and even the Pro Sport class.
@ Joe there are four Bigelows. Kreg, Kris, Kip, and Kirk. All fast dudes. Kip is the
Amatuer Activities director for AMA. Kreg just returned from working in Europe.
Its a double edge sword for ex pro's to compete at LL's. When I won one of the years there was eight different pro's from the 80's on the line.
These ex pro's deserve to race at the Ranch. That is why they put the 30 B/C out
there. Good for Scott to come back to the Ranch and get that feel again. And congrats to my buddy Dave Moegle for winning the +45. He had some issues at
the Red Bud Reg event. He had a crash and I thought it put the LL out of reach to
compete.
@ Fred none of my posts were whines, great respect to anyone I mentioned and bunch I didnt. Let em ride.
too many vet classed for pro's to ride in, only 1 B/C class for vet amateurs, changes need to be made
You stated that this was Dave Moegle's first title but from the August 4th Bench Racing Ammo article for the LL's Hall of Fame you showed that he won the 250B Modified class in 1984.
I agree with John... There are FAR more amateur vet riders that would like a chance at a championship than former licensed Pro riders. In my opinion, it would be better to have one Vet Pro Sport class and then make all other Vet classes for true amateurs. As the article posted... Clark is a Dunlop test rider. While he doesn't race that often, he surely rides as part of his job and keeps the rust out for sure. Most of us vet riders have jobs to support our families outside of the industry which only allows us to ride a limited amount of time and not take the chances that we did in our youth. The masses of vet riders going to Loretta's are in that same boat with only 1 class to be in contention for a legit championship for us normal guys... vet 30b/c. Since there is much less of the Pro riders... you would think that there would only be one or two classes for them instead of the masses of amatuers. My thoughts... If you ever held a Pro License, you should be funneled into Vet Pro Sport class. You would also be eligible to race any other A class at Loretta's. If you finish top 5 at Loretta's in any amateur Vet Class... you would be moved up to the Vet Pro Sport class the following year. How many more Vet riders would hit up the qualifiers knowing that they could have more than one class to potentially be in contention for a championship?
The question is...Who wants to race for 10th - 20th in 35 plus with no hope of a championship? The only reason that I will be looking to qualify in 35 plus next season is so I'm not down at the ranch with only 1 class to race. I'm not looking forward to racing for a mid pack finish next year in that class. Unfortunately, I don't have the luxury of practicing 4-5 times a week to be competitive in the top 10 in that class. ...Not to mention I'm not a former factory rider and never held a national number, so even if I was able to practice that much... I still wouldn't be able to compete with those guys.
SHEAK COME BACK AND RACE UNADILLA!!!!
Yep, Vet pro needs their own class, and then the real amateur vets can race for titles.
Great to see Scotty bouncing back. Always loved watching him and Tony Larusso battle at Southwick, on 80's and on the big bikes.
A full gate for the +45 +50 would be a welcome improvement for the event.The last ime I rode Loretta's was 1994 ,the year i turned 40,for the 40+. Let some of the old guys have some fun.
I think they need to have a class for Vets who held pro licenses anytime in the past and the rest of the Vet classes should be limited to true amateurs Vet classes or do away with the Pro licensed Vets class altogether. The Vets get limited gates now. There are only 20 gates in 50 plus Masters and 30 gates in 45 plus Vet. It is just not fair to have pros competing against the true amateur Vets with such limited gates. It takes a lot of money, time, preparation, travel, loss of worktime and sacrifice to go to LL. I have been to LL twice and the 2007 World Vets FIM race in Europe. Everyone should have a shot and with the limited Vet gates, the present system just is not fair to the Vet amateurs.
Glenn
Gotta let these former pro vet racers come and race just make +40B +45B for those who have never held a pro card at any time. once you get fast enough the regular weekend racer can move up. Would make more money for MX Sports and fill gates to +50 classes.
Keep it simple.
If a rider has ever earned a pro national point, they should be excluded from the LL Amateur nationals vet class's (unless a vet pro class is created). They CAN ride the LL Amateur nationals in the designated Pro classes (250 & 450 pro).
Easy to regulate it and any rider in the past could get a pro card (regardless if they should gave or not).
The Vet classes give a chance to those who may of not had bikes when younger, or there kids got into racing and dad wanted to grow into it with them.
Regardless, when you have EARNED a national point in competition, congratulations, you have become a professional, be proud.
I said it before I care if the ex pro's line up in the age groups at the Lorreta Lynn's finals. I am just glad to see them racing. I too would not be elgible cause I raced against some of the old timers then though it did not matter either we just called it the "A" class. @ joe motocross ya I started racing in 72 and I though you were an old fart. I was just glad to make some money again in the over 30 expert clas, when I turned 30. Got pissed at the promoters here in texas(started racing in the midwest Iowa Ill and MO.) when the 28 year olds would sign up over 30 expert I retired when Hawthorne and those guys started racing in my class when I was 38. I was just glad to have them to race against.
I can see both sides: just having former pros at LL is cool-it ads some PR hype and great riders. But as a vet rider who's tried many times to make it to LL and never made it out of the regionals, it always blew my mind that I was racing against people that I had seen race on TV! The spots at the qualifiers are few, the spots on the gate at the ranch are few.....get the former pros their own classes. I could win a +30A local race, but I'm not on the same lap as Clark Stiles/Emig/etc. It just doesn't pass the smell test - I don't care if they're "former," thery're still pros racing at the Amateur National Championships. Just as an aside-one of the last times I got to ride with my best riding buddy was at a regional in Iowa. Made it all the way there, were both in a qualifying spot to finally make it to LL, and in the 3rd moto we took each other out in the first corner! Bummer. Shortly thereafter he was diagnosed with and quickly succombed to cancer. Miss you and love you 797. Enjoy riding, and enjoy your friends every chance you get.
Congratulations to +50 class winner Scottie Shipley (in dominating fashion). I'm disappointed I've not seen one picture of him or heard any real reference of his victory. He's probably the most respected rider here in D29/13 (NC & Va} and he mostly signs up , and wins, with racers much younger than him, multiple classes too! He has a pro background, but dang, so do many of the older Vets out there, so what! He's paid his dues and I for one am very proud and happy for him. He has always been a role model for many of our area racers and guys like him are hard to find... Way to go Maw 22 !!!
I think the 45 and 50 plus classes should have 40 riders on the gate like all the other classes! They can handle it.
There should be a Vet Pro Class...Can an X- Pro rider really feel good about winning a Title in a class mostly filled with real Amateur racers...?
They should win...So what's the point?
We paid to see them race at National's and in Supercross.
Now we're paying to have them kick our A&# at the World's Largest Amateur National...!
Maybe RC can come back and lap the field 3 or 4 times. Since he already lapped a field of Pro's in his Prime. This would be fun to watch.
With the current attitude on this why not? Sounds fair right?
RC should race the +25 vet class next year. That would expose the idiocy of the current vet class system at Loretta's. Or wait a few more years and race the 35+ class and beat everybody by 3 full minutes. I'd race it just to say I raced against RC, but would it be fair/make sense?
No Those riders know how true privateers feel its part of racing just saing
to bad # 41 from n.w.indiana got twisted in the qualifier or the 30 b/c results would hace been alittle diff. at the top.
Dont worry boys theres plenty of sand baggin in the 30b/c class as well. supplemental rule no6 states " if you have EVER been classified as A or held a pro liscense you cannot ride the B/C class. So how is it that these guys can ride 30A at home and then come to my regional and ride +35, +40 and 30B/C ?
Hello All,
I won the VET 45+ at LL this year (must have got lucky) LOL.
First i would like to say thank you to all of the guys here in Michigan that have helped over the years. The "VET PRO" question is very difficult. What if the all the Curent Vet classes (25, 30, 35, 40, 45 & 50) were for Amateurs and just add "Vet Pro 30, 40, 50 and have 25 riders in each class and they are in the first gate drop of the corresponding Vet Amateur class. Also add, if you win a title in one of the Vet amateur classes then you get bumped up to the Pro class. The over all level of Vet rider ability has changed dramaticly, when i was 17 if some old guy ( 40 ) beat you, your friends would laugh you out of the track. Now alot of us ride the "A" class so we are not cherry picking the "B" class.
How would you police the "PRO" rule? does the AMA have all or the records of who was a pro?
I think we (motocrossers) are different, we crash at 50MPH and as soon as we stop flipping along the ground were running to our bikes to get back on and into the fight. A Guy in the 40+ class broke his collar bone in the first moto and rode the last two also.
I am just thankful to be associated with you guys!!!
David Moegle #38
Michigan Mafia.